A Bruce Timm 'Spider-Man' Cartoon?

[Stu]

Hey,

In the past, we've seen Bruce Timm's version of Batman, Superman, and several other DC Comics characters, most of whom currently star in Justice League. My question to you is this,

After Timm is done with the JLU, would you like to see his attempt at a Spider-Man animated series?

 

[TheScarecrow]

I'd love to see his take on it, if nothing else.

 

[Spidey2099]

It would be awesome if Timm got back in touch with TMS. I really want a Spidey cartoon that could rival The Batman/ Superman Adventures.

It still bugs me that every single TNBA/STAS that was made by TMS was beautiful, but only a handful of Spider-Man episodes came out passable even though it was animated completely by TMS. Every episode should have looked like "Night of the Lizard".

 

[Stu]

It would be awesome if Timm got back in touch with TMS. I really want a Spidey cartoon that could rival The Batman/ Superman Adventures.

It still bugs me that every single TNBA/STAS that was made by TMS was beautiful, but only a handful of Spider-Man episodes came out passable even though it was animated completely by TMS. Every episode should have looked like "Night of the Lizard".

Exactly. Spider-Man has arguably the best villians, the best supporting cast and when written correctly, the best character in all of comics.

So why, in one form or another has every single Spider-Man cartoon failed to live up to Timm's Batman/Superman cartoons?

 

[Patrick Bateman]

I'd love it. Timm's streamlined style would work really well with Spider-Man.

 

[Spidey2099]

So why, in one form or another has every single Spider-Man cartoon failed to live up to Timm's Batman/Superman cartoons?

Well, when you break it down:

The late 60's Spider-Man series, as well as the two Spidey series of the 80's, fell victim to the wacky/ zany/ stereotypical plot formulas that were standard of their time, while the 90's Spider-Man suffered from bad creative organization that wouldn't let the series establish a stable foundation. This led to Spider-Man Unlimited's downfall, starting a new series based on already shaky territory, then topping it off by taking the character out of his environment. MTV Spider-Man would have been better off 1) losing the movie ties, 2) toning down the pop/ teen drama significantly, and, IMO, 3) just making the series hand-drawn instead of 3D animation.

And I believe I've just summarized what's been said on this board already...

 

[randomguy]

It's been my hope for a while that, once Timm was done with DC properties, he'd bring his magic to Marvel characters. Though I think a Bruce Timm Spider-Man would be interesting, I'd much rather see him take on Daredevil. I'm not sure Timm's artistic style is right for Spidey... in fact, I don't really think it's the right fit at all.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be perfectly happpy to see Timm producing the show, and maintaining creative control over it. However, I wouldn't want to see his character designs. Ideally, Timm would guide the scripts and character development while designs like Matsuda's would be used for the animation. That's my dream scenario.

 

[Ssrn53]

I never been a big fan of Timm's animated style. I have seen many IMO comic art styles I like better. As far as Timm doing Marvel cartoons, I'd rather have a good writer(s) from the DC animated cartoons than Timm. He can keep the animated style. What marvel needs are good animated series writers.

 

[Spider-Man]

I'd like to see Timm tackle the animated Spider-Man, but I don't think it would successfully translate. He could oversee it and bring in the use of continuity he does for the DC shows but I don't think his style would successfully translate. Matsuda seems like a good pick. Spider-Man could look really great if it had the right amount of manga influence that you see in Matsuda's work. Just compare Timm's Spider-Man and Matsuda's Spider-Man:

Bruce Timm:
http://www.popcultureshock.com/timm/gallery/1719.jpg

Jeff Matsuda:
http://www.jeffmatsuda.com/animation/development/spideyfull.html

 

[GL2k2]

I think Timm handling the Marvel U is much in demand now that we've seen what he's capable of with DCU. I think he should really start with the Fantastic Four. Sure, Spider-Man has more characterization and drama, but FF will pique Timm's intrest with some of the best Kirby art of any comic series.

I also think that if Timm develops it with writers Paul Dini, Dwayne McDuffie, and maybe even get Stan Lee tapped to write an episode here and there to create a new story, it would rock. But the FF's adventures are absolute classic. There in lies the problem with most Marvel toons, the stories are not as more classic than DC comics. Sure hardcore fans of DC like my brother will remember storylines from DC comics, but I never really saw DC like that. Marvel was a huge soap opera with stories and a mythos that has eclipsed most all DC's one shot stories. If Timm is not a Marvel fan, he might have to redo stuff to the point that ruined most Marvel toons, you lose the part that was attractive to begin with. I think Marvel stories are like Greek myths, you will mess up the context of the stories to the point if you change one thing it will not make much sense.

A reason I didn't care for the Spider-man movie is he's not a kid anymore with highschool drama. We've all been through that, and that was what was attractive to us. Putting a teenager in red and blue tights wise-cracking like Chris Rock is much more attractive than a college student. Also, he didn't have organic webbing, I remember when Spidey had to pay for webbing over food in his refrigerator. Those are things that if changed make the stories less great and pretty much like every superhero stuff that copied them since.

 

[Anarky]

i don't know timm's hiring status
is he under contract by wba or is he free to resign whenever he pleases

either way, i don't see Marvel outbidding WBA for his services
he's created too many profitable shows to let him walk over to the competition

the closest we'll ever get to a Timm Spidey series is Batman Beyond

besides, i'm sure timm has more work ahead of him in the dcau

 

[Nick K.]

He must take on the Marvel Animated Universe. It would be a dream come true.

 

[Bubblegum Girl]

If Stan Lee was able to crossover DC Comics and Bruce Timm can do the same! Think of the possibilities....We might be able to see a decent Marvel cartoon!(With the exception of X-Men:Evolution of course.... ) One time I was looking at an old Wizard magazine preview ad and saw what might have been a Bruce Timm version of the Avengers. I should probably find it and scan it for ya guys.

 

[GL2k2]

If Stan Lee was able to crossover DC Comics and Bruce Timm can do the same! Think of the possibilities....We might be able to see a decent Marvel cartoon!(With the exception of X-Men:Evolution of course.... ) One time I was looking at an old Wizard magazine preview ad and saw what might have been a Bruce Timm version of the Avengers. I should probably find it and scan it for ya guys.

I remember that, it also had the big cheeses Iron Man, Cap, Thor, etc. the way the series should have been done.

Anyway, I don't think using X-Men Evo was a good way to describe a Timm Marvel toon. The truth is if it is done, we have not seen anything like it. I think he would come at the Marvel U from a different standpoint, as I said before, Marvel has been a company that made storytelling and characters stand out more than just a premise like DC characters. The reason why the DCAU works is because, in a sense, they Marvel-ized the classic characters of DCU but they also kept DC's sense of "Bleh" storytelling. That's not necessarily a bad thing, in fact for tv animation it works, cause you can't have huge storylines and villains throughout a series and keeping on track with that.

Though I will say shows like Superman and Gargoyles kept that Marvel way of storytelling. And X-Men Evo can think the guys who used to work on both BTAS and Gargoyles for coming in and making it the way they did. But I don't think we've seen the best Marvel toon that can be created.

The closest I think the Marvel toons got to actually being like the spirit of the comics was the Marvel hour with Iron Man and Fantastic Four. But it was done in a tongue in cheek corny kind of way and the animation for the second seasons of those weren't the best. I think if Timm gets a hold of a Marvel property, like Avengers (which would be close to something like JL's "A Better World") or Fantastic Four (which should be done in the vein of STAS with a lot of Kirby influence) then it's got to go for the gusto without slacking. It's got to be Samurai Jack, Clone Wars, and JL season 2 combined. It's got to be deadly serious with a thick budget. And I know getting the license for Iron Man, Cap, and Hulk is going to be tough right about now.

If you ask me, I think I'd like to see Timm do something like "Kamandi" (which I think might be too much like Samurai Jack now) or something completely outside of comics like a series based on a movie property or something. But with Marvel having a buttload of films developing and none available for the small screen, it may not be a good time for an animated series.

 

[Bubblegum Girl]

Anyway, I don't think using X-Men Evo was a good way to describe a Timm Marvel toon.

I didn't say that XME was a Timm Marvel toon. I was saying that most of the Marvel cartoons weren't really that good. XME was one of the few Marvel cartoons that was worth watching.

If you ask me, I think I'd like to see Timm do something like "Kamandi" (which I think might be too much like Samurai Jack now) or something completely outside of comics like a series based on a movie property or something. But with Marvel having a buttload of films developing and none available for the small screen, it may not be a good time for an animated series.

What's Kamandi?

 

[GL2k2]

I didn't say that XME was a Timm Marvel toon. I was saying that most of the Marvel cartoons weren't really that good. XME was one of the few Marvel cartoons that was worth watching.

What's Kamandi?

I didn't say X-Men Evo was a Timm Marvel toon either, I just didn't think it was good to use as an example to aspire to. I didn't care for X-Men Evo as it was missing a lot of what Marvel is about, and it was made for teenyboppers, thus the explanation of making Storm, Jean, and Cyclops teens.

The original 90's X-Men wasn't great, but it was the closet to a good X-Men toon yet. And perhaps that hurt it.

Kamandi is a comic book created by Jack Kirby about a boy who lives in post apocalyptic future.

 

[EddieTheEditor]

Thought this deserves to be here:
http://www.popcultureshock.com/timm/search.php?query=marvel&pg=1

And yeah, Cap looks funky. Bad funky.

 

[Eddie G.]

Thought this deserves to be here:
http://www.popcultureshock.com/timm/search.php?query=marvel&pg=1

And yeah, Cap looks funky. Bad funky.

The funky Cap pics are meant to be funky, I've seen him draw Batman all weird and funky like that. Specifically his knock against censorship on B:TAS.

He has some other cool Cap pics on the page, one is in TNBA style and one is all Golden Age looking.

As for the subject at hand, I would love to see B.T. do the character designs for a Spiderman toon. Just imagine how creative team for me would be Timm and Bendis. Timm giving his sweet artwork and Bendis brining his great understanding of teens and fresh writing.

 

[Nick K.]

SO does anyone have the pic of the Avengers drawn by BT from Wizard?

 

[GL2k2]

^^ Actually, that pic from Wizard wasn't drawn by Timm it was influenced by him.

Anyway, I saw most of the pics on that site, some of which I don't remember seeing at all. This is why I refer you step back to my earlier post why I suggest Fantastic Four and Avengers. But that's just me.