Proposed MAU Timeline

[Christopher Glennon]

Let me start off by saying the MAU is nowhere near as complete or consistent as the DCAU. In the DCAU, we can see the flow from one show to another, the characters have an easier time changing over, and the timeline makes perfect sense.

There was once a discussion about whether or not you could consider the five Marvel cartoons of the early-mid 90's...X-Men, Spider-Man, Fantastic Four, Iron Man, and Hulk...as happening in the same universe. That can be read here - [FONT=&quot]http://forums.toonzone.net/showthread.php?t=100897[/FONT]

It's not that hard to think of them as all happening at once. Characters like Dr. Strange ("Sins of the Fathers" part 1; "Mind Over Anti-Matter") Ghost Rider ("When Calls Galactus", "Innocent Blood"), Daredevil ("The Man Without Fear; "And A Blind Man Shall Lead Them"), and Thor ("To Battle A Living Planet; "Mortal Bounds"; Phoenix Saga) are all, for the most part, consistent from show to show.

I think the best way to approach an MAU is to think of all the shows with an overlapping timeline. After all, in "Night of the Lizard", Spider-Man rattles off a bunch of other heroes (although the Defenders reference is a bit of a problem). So here's the timeline I thought up. Feel free to disagree/raise counterpoints/point out mistakes or inconsistencies/offer up your own. I originally had this just for fun, but I'm wondering how others view it:

The X-Men episode "Old Soldiers" happens in the 1940's, where we see Captain America fight alongside Wolverine.

Hydro-Man makes the scene in the Spider-Man episode "Hydro-Man".

Spider-Man teams up with the X-Men in the two-part Spider-Man episode "The Mutant Agenda" and "Mutant's Revenge".

Hawkeye, Scarlet Witch, and Century leave Force Works in the Iron Man episode "The Beast Within".

Hydro-Man joins the Frightful Four in the Fantastic Four episode "The Wind Cries Medusa".

Sasquatch works alongside Alpha Flight in the X-Men episode "Repo Man".

Iron Man spends some time in New York, teaming up with Spider-Man in the Spider-Man episodes "Venom Returns" and "Carnage" and possibly meets the Avengers.

In the X-Men episodes "One Man's Worth", alternate reality versions of Wasp and Goliath are seen.

In the X-Men's Phoenix Saga episode "Cry of the Banshee", Juggernaut assaults Gladiator and is flung from Ireland into the Atlantic Ocean.

Juggernaut emerges from the Atlantic Ocean in New York in the Fantastic Four episode "Nightmare in Green". The Hulk also shows up in New York.

Hulk heads out west and meets Iron Man in the Iron Man episode "Hulk Buster".

Hulk later seeks out Tony Stark's help in the Hulk episode "Helping Hand, Iron Fist".

Hulk shows up in Canada, where Sasquatch has taken a leave of absence from Alpha Flight in the Hulk episode "Man To Man, Beast To Beast".

While spending time away from Iron Man and Force Works, the Scarlet Witch contacts Quicksilver and goes to Wundagore Mountain in the X-Men episode "Family Ties".

Hydro-Man makes his final appearance in the Spider-Man episode "The Return of Hydro-Man".

The Scarlet Witch returns to Force Works in the Iron Man episode "Hands of the Mandarin".

In the Hulk episode "Doomed", Hulk fights Dr. Doom and Jennifer Walters becomes the She-Hulk.

Bruce Banner takes She-Hulk to New York where she meets The Thing in the Hulk episode "Fantastic Fortitude".

Captain America escapes a suspended temporal thing in the Spider-Man Six Forgotten Warriors episode "Secret of the Six". He is trapped once again in "The Price of Heroism".

Captain America is briefly freed in Spider-Man's "Secret War" episodes. Spider-Man also meets Iron Man, the Fantastic Four, Dr. Doom, and Storm. Captain America returns to suspended animation.

At some point, Captain America is permanently freed from suspended animation and She-Hulk leaves Bruce Banner's side. They, and Iron Man, spend time with the Avengers (including Wasp and Goliath), as seen in the Fantastic Four episodes "To Battle A Living Planet" and "Doomsday".

As you can see, this whole thing is like a big jigsaw puzzle. The pieces don't fit exactly, you have to account for some changes in appearance, and Hulk is all over the map, but it was the best I could come up with. I welcome your thoughts.

 

[Jeremiah]

Very cool. But do you think that The new Spectacular Spider-Man series will share the same continuity as Fantastic Four:WGH show?

 

[Caswin]

Very cool. But do you think that The new Spectacular Spider-Man series will share the same continuity as Fantastic Four:WGH show?

First, that's highly doubtful for more reasons than I care to go into right now.

Second, we're talking about the 90s cartoons. Those two are way too recent to be issues.

I can't comment too much, not having seen much outside of Fantastic Four and a few episodes of Spider-Man, but it looks good. Interesting theory regarding Captain America.

 

[Cypher Rage]

I always found it wierd that Hydro-Man joined the Frightful Four in the Marvel Cartoons. You'd think once he regained his shape after his original appearance in Spider-man that he'd continue his pursuit for Mary-jane. I guess he was really just the best replacement for Sandman.

 

[lordsmurf]

The 1960s Marvel and DC were related universes too. Each one had a handful of shows, and there was some crossover, if I recall correctly (not between DC and Marvel, but between the DC's and the Marvel's).

Even a number of the 1970s/80s Marvel could be considered the same universe (X-MENryde, Spiderman, S&AF, Spiderwoman, Hulk, F4).

 

[Jeremiah]

Even if those 90's Cartoons were in the same coninuity.The writer's in my opinion did a really crappy job of showing it.But I got to say 90's cartoon man you've made some really valid observations.

Edit by Stu: Please watch your language. This is a kid friendly board.

 

[Christopher Glennon]

I can't comment too much, not having seen much outside of Fantastic Four and a few episodes of Spider-Man, but it looks good. Interesting theory regarding Captain America.

It's tough not having the DVDs, I only have Fantastic Four and my memory to go on. Which is a real shame because I'd like to see how Scarlet Witch is portrayed in X-Men again and compare that to her role on Iron Man.

It was tough fitting Captain America into it, particularly since Spider-Man was so insistent that he remained in that darn vortex!

I always found it wierd that Hydro-Man joined the Frightful Four in the Marvel Cartoons. You'd think once he regained his shape after his original appearance in Spider-man that he'd continue his pursuit for Mary-jane. I guess he was really just the best replacement for Sandman.

My theory is he had trouble looking human and sought out the Wizard. Notice the Wizard identifies them all as "inventors", so maybe he taught Hydro-Man how to better control his powers. And that possibly lead him to seek out Miles Warren (although now I can't remember how they got together in the first place).

Even if those 90's Cartoons were in the same coninuity.The writer's in my opinion did a really crappy job of showing it.But I got to say 90's cartoon man you've made some really valid observations.

Thanks. The thing is, aside from Fantastic Four and Iron Man which ran alongside each other and Hulk which sort of sprung out of that, these five shows weren't made to fit into the same universe, at least not directly, like Batman, Superman, and the DC spin-offs were. It all depends on how close/similar the production teams are. Which is why I don't expect Fantastic Four: WGH to have anything to do with either the new Spider-Man or X-Men cartoons.

 

[Jeremiah]

Oh yeah because Iron Man and the Fantastic Four were part of the Marvel Action Hour. Man i can be a real numbskull at times.

 

[batgirl2007]

I don't think the Silver Surfer show is in continuity with the MAU and the Fantastic Four because each had their own different version of Frankie Raye.

 

[maczero]

Really nice timeline. The only thing that strikes me as being out of place is Sasquatch's appearances. When Sasquatch appeared on the Hulk's show, he seemed more out of control and his transformation seemed to be a fairly recent event. I'd say his Hulk appearance pre-dates his Alpha Flight days.

 

[BlackoutCreature]

So you're not counted Spider-Man Unlimited? I always thought that was meant to be a direct sequel to Spider-Man: The Animated Series. If you did it would open up another continuity problem with the High Evolutionary.

 

[Christopher Glennon]

Really nice timeline. The only thing that strikes me as being out of place is Sasquatch's appearances. When Sasquatch appeared on the Hulk's show, he seemed more out of control and his transformation seemed to be a fairly recent event. I'd say his Hulk appearance pre-dates his Alpha Flight days.

That wouldn't really contradict anything I wrote (re-arrange, but not contradict), so you may be right. I can't remember either Sasquatch episode all that well, I didn't put X-Men first for any particular reason.

So you're not counted Spider-Man Unlimited? I always thought that was meant to be a direct sequel to Spider-Man: The Animated Series. If you did it would open up another continuity problem with the High Evolutionary.

Something about Spider-Man Unlimited didn't seem right as a continuation to me. It may have something to do with the fact that he'd meet new versions of the Green Goblin, Kraven, Electro, and Chameleon and rarely make the observation he's already met someone similar to that. Venom and Carnage were a little weird, too. I'd like to think of Spider-Man Unlimited as its own thing.

 

[Cypher Rage]

You've made some great observations 90'sCartoonMan.

 

[BlackoutCreature]

Something about Spider-Man Unlimited didn't seem right as a continuation to me. It may have something to do with the fact that he'd meet new versions of the Green Goblin, Kraven, Electro, and Chameleon and rarely make the observation he's already met someone similar to that. Venom and Carnage were a little weird, too. I'd like to think of Spider-Man Unlimited as its own thing.

Really? I remember Spider-Man referencing them as "local versions" several times, indicating to me his history with there regular-Earth counterparts. Also I remember the Unlimited episode "One is the Loneliest Number" specifically referencing TAS' "The Alien Costume" trilogy.

 

[BCVM22]

Something about Spider-Man Unlimited didn't seem right as a continuation to me. It may have something to do with the fact that he'd meet new versions of the Green Goblin, Kraven, Electro, and Chameleon and rarely make the observation he's already met someone similar to that. Venom and Carnage were a little weird, too. I'd like to think of Spider-Man Unlimited as its own thing.

Unlimited clearly had ties to the earlier animated series, from the guitar riff theme being used in the first episode, to Venom and Carnage, etc. That said, I could have sworn that when the series was still current, one of the writers said that they used the earlier series as a sort of "jumping off" point for Unlimited, that they wanted to link the two series but kept the links minimal enough that anyone who hadn't seen the earlier series wouldn't be missing much in terms of story content. Whether it was a network edict or a legitimate creative decision, it makes sense either way.

 

[Jeffrey Logan]

There is one guy who connects Iron Man, Spider-Man and X-Men. The guy (probably called father - at least a man in church who´s mission in weddings is to pronounce couples as husband and wife) has appeared in Spider-Man episode Wedding (where Peter Parker marries Mary Jane Watson´s hydroclone), in Iron Man episode The Wedding Of Iron Man (where Julia Carpenter marries Tony Stark the robot) and in X-Men episode ´Til Death Do Us Part: Part 1 (probably in Part 2 as well) (where Scott Summers marries Jean Grey). In X-Men the guy appears to be Morph. The guy himself is: bald (with little hair), wears glasses, wears clothes like usually priests in America do and does not look young at all (near 50).

 

[Christopher Glennon]

Really? I remember Spider-Man referencing them as "local versions" several times, indicating to me his history with there regular-Earth counterparts. Also I remember the Unlimited episode "One is the Loneliest Number" specifically referencing TAS' "The Alien Costume" trilogy.

Unlimited clearly had ties to the earlier animated series, from the guitar riff theme being used in the first episode, to Venom and Carnage, etc. That said, I could have sworn that when the series was still current, one of the writers said that they used the earlier series as a sort of "jumping off" point for Unlimited, that they wanted to link the two series but kept the links minimal enough that anyone who hadn't seen the earlier series wouldn't be missing much in terms of story content. Whether it was a network edict or a legitimate creative decision, it makes sense either way.

I know he referred to past villains a couple times and the Venom origin was similar, but for some reason, something about the series seemed off. Like it was based on the previous Spider-Man show but didn't care if it did anything that outright contradicted it.

There is one guy who connects Iron Man, Spider-Man and X-Men. The guy (probably called father - at least a man in church who´s mission in weddings is to pronounce couples as husband and wife) has appeared in Spider-Man episode Wedding (where Peter Parker marries Mary Jane Watson´s hydroclone), in Iron Man episode The Wedding Of Iron Man (where Julia Carpenter marries Tony Stark the robot) and in X-Men episode ´Til Death Do Us Part: Part 1 (probably in Part 2 as well) (where Scott Summers marries Jean Grey). In X-Men the guy appears to be Morph. The guy himself is: bald (with little hair), wears glasses, wears clothes like usually priests in America do and does not look young at all (near 50).

I didn't know that. That's pretty cool.

 

[Caswin]

I know he referred to past villains a couple times and the Venom origin was similar, but for some reason, something about the series seemed off. Like it was based on the previous Spider-Man show but didn't care if it did anything that outright contradicted it.

Well, no one's saying it was a quality show. Even if the continuity was poorly handled, though, I think there's more evidence for it than against it.

By way of comparison, apart from character designs, is there any evidence on Avengers one way or another?

 

[Christopher Glennon]

Well, no one's saying it was a quality show. Even if the continuity was poorly handled, though, I think there's more evidence for it than against it.

I suppose there is, I just have this strange memory going into it accepting it as a continuation of the previous series, then after a few episodes thinking it'd be better to treat it as its own thing. I'd buy a DVD set of it if one came out (just to have a better memory of it), I don't have anything against the show.

By way of comparison, apart from character designs, is there any evidence on Avengers one way or another?

I can't remember specifics about that show, but their villains (Ultron, Kang, The Zodiac) are all okay since they were specific (I don't think Whirlwind would've been that much of a problem). Captain America and Iron Man may've been all right as well, and Hank/Wasp/Vision cameos on other shows as well. Namor was a little weird since he seemed to have a thing for Wanda (and it was like he never met Sue), but that wouldn't exactly contradict things.

The only real question is how do we view Hawkeye and Scarlet Witch's history, since they were both on Force Works and the Avengers. Were their characterizations consistent? Did Hawkeye say he immediately
joined the Avengers after Swordsman trained him and he left the circus (because I don't know)? I'm pretty sure there was nothing to confirm Avengers was in the same continuity as any other show, but I can't think of any specific evidence against it.

 

[Spider-Man]

This is a great thread but I have a question for you. In the pilot episode of Spider-Man: The Animated Series, Spidey mentioned The Defenders and implies that The Hulk was a part of that team. How would that happen given the Hulk's status in his own animated series?