When did Mac Gargan become Venom?

[Kolbar]

I only recently began reading comics again after many, many years and I was intrigued by the new mini-series "Beyond!" since I was a big fan of the original "Secret Wars" and decided to pick it up. As I was reading it, I saw that the Spider-Man villain Venom was among the group, but I found out that it's not Eddie Brock, but Mac Gargan, the Scorpion.

When and how did that happen?

Thanks.

 

[Xurk]

It happened in one of the sub-arcs of the year-long storyline [dubbed "Shush" by fans and the media] in Marvel Knights: Spider-Man, from issues #1 to #12, by Mark Millar.
The actual occurence of Gargan becoming Venom was in issue #9 [the final panels].

In short, Eddie Brock was dying from cancer [which had been revealed a few years ago in Jenkins' run on Spectacular Spider-Man] and he wanted to get rid of the symbiote before he passed away, so he auctioned it off at a "villain auction". It was bought by Don Fortunato, who gave it to his son, wanting to be able to be proud of him. After the kid was found to be unworthy of the symbiote, by the symbiote, it left his body mid-air and the kid fell to his death. Afterwards, it made its way to Mac Gargan's appartment and struck a deal with him there.
Eddie Brock was shown to have slit his wrists and the doctors declared that he "probably wouldn't make it through the night", although we were never given any proof that they were right in the end.

If you want to read more into the whole thing, start with the review of MK:SM #5 on Spiderfan.org and read onwards from there.

 

[Kolbar]

Okay, thanks. According to Spiderfan.org this was in 2004 so it wasn't too long ago. "Beyond!" is a really good series so far even though I'm not familiar with more than half of the characters.

Thanks again.

 

[solarflere]

Okay, thanks. According to Spiderfan.org this was in 2004 so it wasn't too long ago. "Beyond!" is a really good series so far even though I'm not familiar with more than half of the characters.

Thanks again.

The beginning of Beyond! story is a continuation of Gravity Limited Series
you can find it in your local comic stores, myne still caries it.
Here is a link to the first issue (2005):
http://comics.ign.com/articles/615/615541p1.html
The story is interasting.

 

[Shantosh9500]

Miller is a very brilliant Spidey writer. he brought back most of Spidey's villains and supporting cast and used them in new ways. To me he is the only one in Marvel that knows how to handle the character other than Bendis.

 

[RAINMAN]

I strongly disagree. How many times must we see a bounche of viallins that are losers fight spiderman and lose badly?And it was 12 of them for crying out loud. Then you have viallins who don`t team up whit other viallins in there like the lizard. Mac becoming the new venom was the worst thing to happend to venom even spiderman don`t take him seriousy anymore. And don`t get me started on bendis.

 

[Stu]

RAINMAN, have you actually read this storyline?

Spider-Man didn't defeat The Sinister Twelve, he had help from about 6 different heroes including Captain America, Daredevil and The Fantastic Four, MJ called them after he and Black Cat left to spring The Green Goblin from prison.

Spider-Man then went to stop The Goblin, who was about to kill MJ, but was stopped by the new Venom, whom he brought a building down on.

I personally found the story to be one of the best Spider-Man arcs I've ever read, Millar is one of the few modern writers who actually seems to 'get' Spider-Man. So many others have come close but always seem to fumble somewhere, whilst others, such as JMS and Quesada don't even appear to care.

And please stop your mindless bashing of Brian Micheal Bendis, it's clear you don't even read the books you're constantly critising.

 

[wonderfly]

I, for one, still think it would've been better if the Venom Symbiote grew a Scorpion type tail to reflect it's new master.

I personally found the story to be one of the best Spider-Man arcs I've ever read, Millar is one of the few modern writers who actually seems to 'get' Spider-Man. So many others have come close but always seem to fumble somewhere, whilst others, such as JMS and Quesada don't even appear to care.

Eh, I think Millar's 12 issue story arc had it's moments, but overall, the quality started to sink towards the end, (at least for me). I think there wasn't really a reason for the Lizard to be there, (the Lizard is supposed to be a near-mindless monster, not a "team-up" type of villian). And as I recall, the Chameleon was a part of that "Sinister Twelve" group, and he was supposed to be dead, last I checked, (so actually Millar brought Chameleon back with no explanation before the current writer of Sensational Spider-Man did). And wasn't the Molten Man a part of that group as well? Or am I thinking of Hammerhead? If it was Molten Man, that gets a frown from me as well...

Also, the whole bit where "evil corporations control and create the supervillians to give the good guys someone to fight so that the don't notice what the really evil villians-the corporate leaders-are doing" came across as Millar sharing his "enlightened" beliefs with us again.

And finally, Dr. Octopus is my favorite Spidey villian, and so I couldn't stand to see him used as a brainwashed drone, (a plot device rather than a character).

 

[Ed Liu]

Howdy,

The beginning of Beyond! story is a continuation of Gravity Limited Series
you can find it in your local comic stores, myne still caries it.
Here is a link to the first issue (2005):
http://comics.ign.com/articles/615/615541p1.html
The story is interasting.

I agree -- Gravity is a lot of fun, even if its relative failure in the marketplace would seem to indicate that the proponents for "more fun comics" really mean "more fun comics that have Spider-Man in them."

There is a digest edition TPB that collects the entire series; I babbled much more about the digest before.

-- Ed

 

[solarflere]

Howdy,



I agree -- Gravity is a lot of fun, even if its relative failure in the marketplace would seem to indicate that the proponents for "more fun comics" really mean "more fun comics that have Spider-Man in them."

There is a digest edition TPB that collects the entire series; I babbled much more about the digest before.

-- Ed

I like reading about new characters:
Gravity 1-5
Araña (in Amazing Fantasy 1-6 and Araña 1-12 finished in Spiderman-Araña)
Drax the Destoyer 1-4 ( Annihilation prequel)
StormBreaker: The saga of Beta Ray Bill 1-6 (shows a new Galactus herald Stardust)
Madrox 1-5 (not new but reinvented and beginning of new X-Factor)
Daughters Of The Dragon 1-6 ( a prequel for Civil War Heroes for Hire)
Claws is entertaining as well.
Marvel Team-Up 15-18 featuring Gravity, X23, Dagger, Terror Inc., Sleepwalker, Darkhawk Speedball, and Arana

 

[RAINMAN]

RAINMAN, have you actually read this storyline?

Spider-Man didn't defeat The Sinister Twelve, he had help from about 6 different heroes including Captain America, Daredevil and The Fantastic Four, MJ called them after he and Black Cat left to spring The Green Goblin from prison.

Spider-Man then went to stop The Goblin, who was about to kill MJ, but was stopped by the new Venom, whom he brought a building down on.

I personally found the story to be one of the best Spider-Man arcs I've ever read, Millar is one of the few modern writers who actually seems to 'get' Spider-Man. So many others have come close but always seem to fumble somewhere, whilst others, such as JMS and Quesada don't even appear to care.

And please stop your mindless bashing of Brian Micheal Bendis, it's clear you don't even read the books you're constantly critising.

On for the love of....

I know about the other herioes showing up helping spiderman but they never show the battle, just a bounch of viallins lay out ready to be taken back to jail. And I know about the whole bridge thing "again" and how spiderman told mac a loser in a venom suit is still a loser. Right before he brought the building down on him. Was that miller way of showing the new venom was gonna be more dangerious then the old one? It may work for you but show didn`t work for me. Unless you can tell why the lizard " a villain in his primal state of mind that lashes out at any&every one except his family" was there?

And just so you know I read NEW Avangers a few times and a little bit of daredevil. I don`t like his work on NA. I don`t feel the need to prove that I read comic book but sense you seem to think all I do is make mindless bashing for no reason, then I`ll just have to make myself clear next time.

 

[Doop]

as I recall, the Chameleon was a part of that "Sinister Twelve" group, and he was supposed to be dead, last I checked, (so actually Millar brought Chameleon back with no explanation before the current writer of Sensational Spider-Man did).

No, Chameleon had been brought back before Millar used him.

 

[wonderfly]

No, Chameleon had been brought back before Millar used him.

Well, could you please point me to what issue he was resurrected in? Because last I checked, he was killed by the new Kraven the Hunter in the mid 90's.

 

[Shawn Hopkins]

Chameleon was in an arc of Webspinners some time around 2000. Of course, he appears to die in that arc too.

Gargan has used the symbiote to form a scorpion tail. He did it in the first issue of Beyond. Surprised the hell out of Spider-Man.

Millar did all right with Spider-Man and I enjoyed the arc, but I would not rank him among the better Spider-Man writers. For me that category still includes Stan Lee, Gerry Conway, Jim Owsley/Christopher Priest, Roger Stern, Peter David, Paul Jenkins and maybe a couple of others. I'm not willing to put Bendis in there, either, until I've read more Ultimate Spider-Man.

 

[Doop]

Well, could you please point me to what issue he was resurrected in? Because last I checked, he was killed by the new Kraven the Hunter in the mid 90's.

Yeah, he appeared in Webspinners where he comitted suicide by jumping off a bridge (what I thought you were referring to).

According to Spiderfan.org, "Kraven's son turned his rifle aside at the last moment, and Dimitri had a chance to survive: he is seen in a hospital bed in Spectacular #250, with doctors all around him, who presumably saved him."

Anyway, after his suicide attempt in Webspinners, Ron Zimmerman brought him back without explanation.

 

[RAINMAN]

The problem is Webspinners is such a rear and unknow spider tital that most people(including fans&writers) don`t know about it. I guess they were so concern whit the relunch that they didn`t know there was a fresh new spider book out? Marvel should put all 18 issues in some sort of TBP.

 

[wonderfly]

Ah geez, not the tired old "throw MJ off the bridge to mirror Gwen Stacy" routine...

Okay, now let's back up a minute:

Webspinners, as I recall, was a "Tales of the Dark Knight" type of title, with stories that were meant to be set in different past periods of Spider-Man's life, (in other words, the story arcs didn't have to deal with the present day stories). I only own the first 3 issues, and those were a Mysterio story arc set in Spider-Man's early years. Is it possible this Chameleon story was set a few years prior, before his death at the hands of Kraven? Because falling off a bridge into the water doesn't = "dead". Remember: No visible dead body, no death. On the other hand, gun blast to the face = dead, to me.

Since this thread seems to be a referendum on Millar's Spider-Man story arc, (and the changes it has brought to the Spider-Man mythos), let me point out the things from his story arc which I did like:

I enjoyed the fact that they seperated Venom from Eddie Brock. Giving the symbiote it's own personality was something that I see as a natural progression of Venom. Issue #8 of Millar's story arc had a great action sequence between Venom and Spider-Man as well, (though as I recall, Venom killed off the more of Peter's high school buddies...as many people from that school have died, it's a wonder there's anybody left alive that went to school with Peter).

Also, I liked that Peter fooled J. Jonah Jameson into believing that Spider-Man was actually his son John Jameson. Jameson suddenly became Spider-Man's biggest supporter! Unfortunately, this plot thread wasn't picked up outside of the Reginald Hudlin's story arc in the pages of Spider-Man, (a shame) until finally being acknowledged by Peter David in the pages of Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man,

Spoiler

and I'm putting this in spoilers as it's pretty recent: when Jameson figured out that his son WASN'T Spider-Man, I feel that David was starting up a storyline where Jameson was going to discover Peter was Spider-Man on his own...but instead, that plot abruptly ended when Spider-Man revealed his identity to the world in the pages of Civil War.

 

[Shawn Hopkins]

Some of Webspinners may have been set in different time periods, but the Chameleon arc was by Paul Jenkins and lead directly into his run. It is collected in the "Day in the Life" trade that also collects some of his early issues of Peter Parker: Spider-Man.

 

[RAINMAN]

Say, what about that little clash between Doc Oct & GG? I would surly like to see those two battle each other somewhere down the line.

 

[Ultra8]

Scorpion is now Venom?!
I guess this is the reason why they now have that other Scorpion that works for S.H.E.I.L.D.