"Dragon Ball Kai" FUNimation Home Video Release News & Discussion

[Kaboom]

I'm just sayin': it's hard to take a castrated sounding Goku seriously.

Even if you don't like Goku's boyish voice, there's still at least a reason for it. A grounding in the way his character is written and molded. No such good reason for Linda Young's Freeza. It's just an arbitrary change for the worse which does nothing to help the proper portrayal.

 

[SpaceCowboy]

I'm just sayin': it's hard to take a castrated sounding Goku seriously.

Were you introduced to the character through the original series or Z?
The Japanese audience who grew up seeing both series in succession as it was originally airing were used to the idea of Goku being naive and child-like even into adulthood. In certain respects, he never loses his child-like innocence.
I find Nozawa's voice a bit awkward as well for adult Goku, but the reasoning behind it makes sense.

 

[Razor]

Eh. Freeza is built like a number of characters who sound like him.

Really, what's more important is how his dialogue is written.

 

[Goodfellow]

I have to say, I am really enjoying the new Kai dub. I like Gohan's new voice a lot better, and it sounds pretty close to the Jp voice. ALso, I like how Sabat has lightened up his Piccolo voice, but I still don't like Vegeta's voice. It is still completely off. Oh, and the same goes for Kaio-sama's voice. I hate his dubbed voice. However, the script is quite accurate, and I just cannot get into the new Japanese voices and tones. The new voices to Roshi, Chichi, and Popo are just completely wrong, while Goku and Gohan sound off due to age. I did not stick around to the Jp version to hear how both Vegeta and Freezer sound, but I'm figuring it will be no different than before, and when it comes to Freezer, I might not like his English voice still. I do not know why, but the DB villians always seem to never be right dubbed, as Vegeta, Freezer, Cell, and Buu were completely off in Z, so I am expecting them to be off in Kai.

 

[Innagadadavida]

I'm just sayin': it's hard to take a castrated sounding Goku seriously.

To us, maybe Nozawa's Goku doesn't sound like your average adult male... But Goku is an alien. Is it that hard to assume an alien might sound a little different than a regular adult human? I mean, Linda Young's Freeza sounds considerably different than an adult male. I encourage you to check out this video of Miss Nozawa doing her Goku voice. If you can't accept her interpretation, you can at least respect her incredible range, considering she's pretty up there in age.

 

[Sketch]

Not a big fan of Nozawa as adult Goku or the rest of the adults in the Son family much less Bardock. Seriously... Bardock too? It just doesn't work for me.

However I've yet to find an English dub Goku I feel truly owns the role.

So really I don't particularly care for any of the voices Goku has had and more so tolerate all of them than like any that much than another. I think FUNimation could have gotten a better Goku however Schemmel is giving his best performance as the character to date in this dub so I do appreciate the improvement.

I'd say about the same for Vegeta and Piccolo. Sabat's doing an excellent job with both but they could have gotten a more appropriate voice for at least Vegeta.

But I stress again as I already have in previous threads and I believe this one that Dragon Ball began as a comic. No single voice is THE VOICE for any character. If it began as a cartoon in Japan there would be grounds to say Nozawa is THE VOICE of Goku and Horikawa is THE VOICE of Vegeta. But this was not the case. They were actors hired to portray pre-existing fictional characters. They were the first but they wont be the last and it will remain debatable if they were the best. Because "first is best" is a faulty argument given Kevin Conroy was not the first voice of Batman but many would argue he is the best.

Oh and going back to how Saiyan is pronounced. I think they didn't do it because it sounded awkward and it's a term that has been used for over a decade in the US now. It's not properly pronounced but it is spelled correctly. Which is a bit odd on it's own actually. Why can they spell things correctly but not say them correctly? Sometimes I think they listened to the Japanese voices and thought that was what they were saying and how they pronounced it because I kid you not even in Kai when I hear various characters say Saiyan I here seya-jin not saiya-jin. I know that's not how it's spelled but that's what I'm hearing none the less.

I really don't get Tri-Beam though... why? And why can't he just be Ten with his full name being Tenshinhan. What's wrong the name name Ten? What was wrong with it in the first place? He doesn't have to be refered to as Tenshinhan all the time, but Ten is just as good for a short name or better than Tien. If I had to guess one reason for why it's still Tri-Beam it's because they were going to mention the attack name in the episode title but even then... why couldn't it be the original name? This is the uncut dub not the broadcast dub. Was the concern that they didn't want to have different episode titles for broadcast and uncut? If that's the reason it's still Tri-Beam... that's just lazy.

As I was telling Jacob earlier I was baffled by the voice of Kaio in Japanese. While I've seen DBZ in Japanese for several episodes I do not recall hearing Kaio before. His voice is rather deep and not really what I'd imagine from a visual stand-point. Kind of like how I wouldn't imagine Nozawa's adult Goku for adult Goku from a visual stand-point. When I read a comic I come up with voices in my head that I think would suit the characters. While I wont say Schemmel's Goku or Kaio are what would come to mind they were closer than the Japanese seiyu for those characters and the same could be said for many others.

 

[Innagadadavida]

But I stress again as I already have in previous threads and I believe this one that Dragon Ball began as a comic. No single voice is THE VOICE for any character. If it began as a cartoon in Japan there would be grounds to say Nozawa is THE VOICE of Goku and Horikawa is THE VOICE of Vegeta. But this was not the case. They were actors hired to portray pre-existing fictional characters. They were the first but they wont be the last and it will remain debatable if they were the best. Because "first is best" is a faulty argument given Kevin Conroy was not the first voice of Batman but many would argue he is the best.

How about Toriyama personally picking Nozawa, Horikawa, and Mayumi Tanaka? He says that Nozawa is Goku. So much so that when he was writing dialog, he imagined Nozawa's voice. Is that reason enough?

I really don't get Tri-Beam though... why? And why can't he just be Ten with his full name being Tenshinhan. What's wrong the name name Ten? What was wrong with it in the first place? He doesn't have to be refered to as Tenshinhan all the time, but Ten is just as good for a short name or better than Tien. If I had to guess one reason for why it's still Tri-Beam it's because they were going to mention the attack name in the episode title but even then... why couldn't it be the original name? This is the uncut dub not the broadcast dub. Was the concern that they didn't want to have different episode titles for broadcast and uncut? If that's the reason it's still Tri-Beam... that's just lazy.

It's not laziness. It's a very calculated and carefully considered move and I fully approve. They're keeping attack and character names consistent with the casual consciousness (Spirit Bomb), and of those that appear in the English dub of Dragon Ball. If one were to start from the actual beginning of the story via FUNimation's dub, and substitute FUNimation's English dub of Kai for their English dub of Z, then they won't be confused when a character is suddenly called "Tenshinhan" and he's using a "Kikoho" instead of a "Tri-beam." Continuity over absolute satisfaction of a group which can be anything but.

 

[GohanRice]

Having bought and watched the first set, I applaud FUNimation for finally giving a Dragon Ball series a good, respectable dub. But not "great" or "perfect." There's a disappointing amount of things retained from the old dub that simply shouldn't have been.

- Dumb character and attack names. They're making an "accurate" dub, but still using the names "Tien" and "Tri-Beam?" Really? I wouldn't mind if they just used "TienShinhan" or something. If they want to keep their extra little 'I' then sure, just stop rejecting the entire second half of the character's name in the process. Which reminds me, Goku has a family name: "Son." It exists, FUNi, so use it. And for Dende's sake, they need to start saying "Ki" already, instead of horribly generic terms like "energy" and "power." Both "Son Goku" and "Ki' have been getting used quite often in things like the video games, so why not in the actual series?

- A handful of random, silly line changes. Nappa's "I hate the media!" is the most glaring example, but there were a few others. Like Kami blabbering on about Goku being Earth's last hope or something, instead of talking about how Piccolo is no longer the bloodthirsty demon that his sire was, which is a HUGE part of Pic's character development.

- And of course (and this totally deserves its own spot), effin' Freeza's grating, horrible, hellishly inappropriate dub-voice. This is the ONE aspect that more than anything else needed and still needs to be changed for Kai. Don't get me wrong; I have nothing personal against Linda Young, and she does great in roles that are actually meant to sound like elderly women (such as Baba and YYH's Genkai). But her voice for Freeza has always been an inexcusable blemish on the entire production, and unfortunately it looks like it will continue to be so for Kai.

Hopefully some of these things might still change in the future (especially that last bit, if nothing else). They're really what keep this dub from being the perfect, awesome answer to the good-dub dreams of every long-suffering fan who knows better.


Okay then. I got the few big negatives out of my system. Now for the positives, and why this dub is "good and respectable." While a few somewhat-major, old-dub-inspired flub-ups remain, there's a LOT of other problems that have been fixed.


First and foremost... It actually has an accurate script. I know this aspect should be expected in ANY dub, but it's just SO good to finally be able to watch "DragonBall Z" in English and NOT be disgusted by an outright disregard for the content of the original story, that I don't care. Kai was the perfect opportunity for FUNimation to redeem themselves for their past sins with Z's dub, and, aside from a few slip-ups like those listed above, they've certainly done so with gusto.

I watched these first 13 episodes of Kai entirely via the dub, but with the subtitles for the Japanese version on. I was happily flabbergasted to discover that for at least 95% of the time, the two languages were actually saying the same thing! This is something I once never thought I'd see happen, and I'm glad I was wrong. If the dialogue continues to stay this faithful, then there's about a 5-10% shining chance that it might let me put up with Linda Young's "Freeza" voice for its sake.


Next, there were some names and terminology that were thankfully adjusted for the better. Like the "Makankosappo" (which is WAY more complicated to say than "Kikoho," by the way) and "Kienzan," though hopefully the pronunciation for the latter will be more carefully minded in the future. Finally and most blessed of all, "Kaio-Ken" is at long last being pronounced RIGHT. Now if only they could start doing the same for "Saiyan."


Last but certainly not least, the cast. Oh, the cast. I've said all I've need to say about Freeza, so no more comments on that.

First off, Sabat is really at the top of his game in this. His Piccolo voice is cool, commanding, and deep. His Vegeta is more regal and relaxed, and less raspy. His Yamcha finally sounds just like a confident macho man, instead of a jock-ish douchebag. His direction skills are to thank for a lot of the good things in Kai's dub, and I excitedly look forward to whatever he's got planned for the Ginyu Force.

Mr. Sean Schemmel is really standing out, too. I notice he's toned down the lispy goofiness on Kaio, which is certainly welcome. But I agree with whoever enthusiastically remarked on his Goku earlier. Back in the Freeza arc of Z's dub, when the cast switch from Ocean happened... Schemmel's Goku sucked. Out loud. It was obnoxious, untrained, and had little to no grounding in Goku's actual character.

But now, in Kai, after years of practice and fine-tuning... he's the shining star of the whole production. Schemmel's become a pro at delivering a good balance between the happy, carefree Goku, and the serious, pissed-off-because-you-hurt-his-friends Goku. The character is there, the proper tone is there, and when it's now coupled with a good script that no longer has Goku spouting off heroic speeches with way too many big words...

I won't declare my admiration for his work by saying, "he IS Son Goku" or anything, because that expression will always be reserved for Masako Nozawa alone. But I couldn't possibly think of anyone in FUNimation's talent pool who could pull off the job better. That's a mighty big compliment coming from someone like me who almost always prefers the Japanese version.

Next, some of the replacements. The more minor ones didn't really affect my experience one way or another (though Oolong's new voice was a bit jarring), but the major ones definitely left an impact.

Monica Rial's Bulma voice is much, much, MUCH better than Tiffany Volmer's. The tone is extremely similar, but Rial's far more relaxed and natural, instead of making Bulma sound like a shrill, screechy, annoying b*tch. Bulma was always another voice that often caused me to quickly switch away from the dub, but no more. Bulma as voiced by Monica Rial is one of my favorites.

I also have nothing but good things to say about Colleen Clinkenbeard's Gohan. I can hear a little bit of Luffy in there, true (and I'll expect the voices to be quite similar whenever she ends up voicing young Luffy). But it's not at all distracting. The best part of it is that the voice finally sounds appropriate for meek little 4-year-old Gohan.

Stephanie Nadolny's voicework for him always sounded too deep and old. At best, it was only kinda appropriate for kid Gohan at his oldest, being 11 during the Cell Games (and on that note, works great for 12- to 15-year-old Kid Goku). But it was totally unfitting for him as a 4-year-old. Ms. Clinkenbeard's rendition is FAR more believable given Gohan's age, and hopefully she'll cleverly age it a bit as Kai gets further into the story, until Kyle Hebert eventually takes over after the timeskip into the Boo arc.



So all in all, I agree with the DaizEX review's sentiments that while a lot was changed for the better, FUNimation really should have just gone all-out and not omitted the few remaining major aspects that needed change just as much, if not more. Those few things certainly don't ruin the product as a whole, but it's disappointing that they weren't addressed like they should have been.

For comparison, DBZ's original dub is a definite F for its majority, but capping out at maybe a C for a few rare, well-handled things like chunks of the Boo arc and one or two of the movies. In contrast, I give the Kai dub a solid B+. It's a very good dub and a MASSIVE step up from that of DBZ. But a few glaring, shouldn't-exist problems keep it from being "perfect."

Saying TienShinHan is kinda mouth full I know they did that in the first Dragon Ball Series.

 

[PC!]

To us, maybe Nozawa's Goku doesn't sound like your average adult male... But Goku is an alien. Is it that hard to assume an alien might sound a little different than a regular adult human?

I like that point. I still hate his Japanese voice, but that's an interesting way of looking at it that I never considered.

 

[Taekmkm]

Then why aren't every other Saiyans high-pitched? Every pure Saiyan is gruff sounding except Goku, and he's old enough to reach physical maturity.

 

[Ryusuke]

How about Toriyama personally picking Nozawa, Horikawa, and Mayumi Tanaka? He says that Nozawa is Goku. So much so that when he was writing dialog, he imagined Nozawa's voice. Is that reason enough?

I don't think even with the creator's say that all people would accept that voice as THE Goku voice. But, in all curiosity, did he really pick them? There any source for that?

 

[KYO'NYUU IMOUTO]

I don't think even with the creator's say that all people would accept that voice as THE Goku voice. But, in all curiosity, did he really pick them? There any source for that?

From Daizenshû 3:

--Where there any jobs you did directly for the “DB” anime?

Toriyama: In cases where characters appeared in the anime before they were shown in color in the manga, I sent a response to the animators at Toei through my editor. After that, I listened to the voice actor audition tapes, and decided on the casting. When I decided on Goku’s voice, I listened to the voices of five or six candidates, and out of those I decided on Masako Nozawa-san.

--What were your impressions on hearing Goku’s voice during the actual broadcast?

Toriyama: I went “Goku has this sort of voice, doesn’t he”. From then on, when I was drawing the manga, the characters’ voices would somehow drift up in my mind. Whenever that happened, Goku’s voice would be just like Nozawa-san’s, and I’d think “Geez, she’s good”. Now it’s impossible to separate Goku from Nozawa-san.

--Did you choose any of the other characters?

Toriyama: I was present for the selection of the other major roles. After that, I suppose I only designated Mayumi Tanaka-san as the voice of Krillin. When I saw “Night on the Galaxy Railroad” (note 1), I said the protagonist had a really good voice, and a very knowledgeable friend of mine told me that it was Mayumi Tanaka-san.

 

[Innagadadavida]

Then why aren't every other Saiyans high-pitched? Every pure Saiyan is gruff sounding except Goku, and he's old enough to reach physical maturity.

Bardock? Tullice?
Granted, they both also look like Goku, but somebody could easily create an in-universe theory about all that.

 

[KYO'NYUU IMOUTO]

Bardock? Tullice?
Granted, they both also look like Goku, but somebody could easily create an in-universe theory about all that.

Vegeta even. Horikawa's no Iizuka (Nappa) or Satô (King Vegeta) when it comes to playing a 'gruff' Saiyan. Vegeta by far a 'proper' prince in comparison.

 

[MugiwaraMikey]

To us, maybe Nozawa's Goku doesn't sound like your average adult male... But Goku is an alien. Is it that hard to assume an alien might sound a little different than a regular adult human?

While I agree with you, it doesn't apply for other characters. Like Vegeta; despite being an alien, he sounds normal. And what about Krillin, he keeps the same high-pitched voice throughout the show too and he's just a human?

 

[Innagadadavida]

Krillin also doesn't have a nose.

 

[KYO'NYUU IMOUTO]

While I agree with you, it doesn't apply for other characters. Like Vegeta; despite being an alien, he sounds normal. And what about Krillin, he keeps the same high-pitched voice throughout the show too and he's just a human?

There's a clear difference between his teen and adult voices, actually.


There's really no 'in universe' explanation for this sort of thing. It just is what is it, the same voice actor. There was simply no real reason to drop actors with a 120+ episodes of experience playing the characters when they're as talented as they are to develope the characters both in terms of acting and making them sound older.

 

[MugiwaraMikey]

Krillin also doesn't have a nose.

Aha! Touche, my friend.

There's a clear difference between his teen and adult voices, actually.

But in general, it sounds the same.

There's really no 'in universe' explanation for this sort of thing. It just is what is it, the same voice actor. There was simply no real reason to drop actors with a 120+ episodes of experience playing the characters when they're as talented as they are to develope the characters both in terms of acting and making them sound older.

I know. And it works too (for the most part). That's what I go by. I just don't like how ALL of the male members of the Son family have the exact same voice. And okay Jacob, I know you're gonna be like "but they're all slightly different!" but I meant that it IS obvious they're all by the same person. I wish they'd spice it up a bit and use different actors.

 

[Innagadadavida]

Chris Sabat voices a lot of characters too. And I'd argue that each of his sound much more unique than each of Nozawa's characters.

 

[MugiwaraMikey]

Chris Sabat voices a lot of characters too. And I'd argue that each of his sound much more unique than each of Nozawa's characters.

I know, I had that in mind when I typed my last post. And I agree, about 98% of Sabat's voices sounded completely different. Before I knew any better, I honestly couldn't tell that all of those voices were by the same person. But I knew right off the bat that who Nozawa voiced when I first watched the Japanese version.