Has streaming been better for adult animation than kids' animation?

[PicardMan]

Except you wouldn't have seen something like Arcane, Invincible, or Castlevania in the 90s or 2000s, it's hard to say that adult animation is somehow in a worse position now than it was in the 90s or 2000s when we are finally seeing stuff produced that is not Simpsons, Family Guy or South Park clones.

No one is arguing that Western animation hasn't made major artistic artistic innovations in the 2020s. It's commercial viability that is the big question mark. Streamers have revived the non comedy adult cartoon from the dead, but the acceptance of these by the mainstream audience seems small and it seems like mainly the hardcore "cartoon geek" audience watching most of these. Castlevania got to four seasons by marketing itself as a Netflix Anime(tm) as the anime audience is used to concept of adult non comedy cartoons. This technique of labeling non comedy cartoons as Netflix anime(tm) has had mixed results as seen with stuff that isn't based on a licensed property like Seis Manos. It doesn't seem like these shows are that far behind adult comedy animation as adult comedies seem to chart for two weeks instead of one week before fading into oblivion. "Binge, move on, and forget" is just bad for cartoons. I'd be shocked if I surveyed random people off the streets and any of them even know what Scavengers Reign and Captain Laserhawk even are.

 

[The Overlord]

No one is arguing that Western animation hasn't made major artistic artistic innovations in the 2020s. It's commercial viability that is the big question mark. Streamers have revived the non comedy adult cartoon from the dead, but the acceptance of these by the mainstream audience seems small and it seems like mainly the hardcore "cartoon geek" audience watching most of these. Castlevania got to four seasons by marketing itself as a Netflix Anime(tm) as the anime audience is used to concept of adult non comedy cartoons. This technique of labeling non comedy cartoons as Netflix anime(tm) has had mixed results as seen with stuff that isn't based on a licensed property like Seis Manos. It doesn't seem like these shows are that far behind adult comedy animation as adult comedies seem to chart for two weeks instead of one week before fading into oblivion. "Binge, move on, and forget" is just bad for cartoons. I'd be shocked if I surveyed random people off the streets and any of them even know what Scavengers Reign and Captain Laserhawk even are.

Oh sure, but that's a problem affecting the entire entertainment industry. A lot of live action shows people liked like 1899 and Shadow and Bone get cancelled and something based on existing IP like Wednesday does well.

I think animation gets it somewhat worse than live action shows due to expense, but the way Netflix treats animated shows is not too much different from how it treats live action shows, you can apply the same complaints to animated and live action shows.

I still think cartoon series for kids gets worse than shows for adults, Amazon Prime makes animation, but almost none of it is for kids..

 

[PicardMan]

Come to think of it, American action cartoons have almost always relied on being based on existing IPs, with Transformers and Ninja turtles being some of the few kids action cartoons getting any merchandise at all. It's weird that right now, I can't think of any kids comedy cartoons on streaming that aren't based on existing properties like Tiny Toons or Animaniacs. Some say that dramedy cartoons like Adventure Time killed the pure comedy genre of kids cartoons, but The Cuphead Show did fairly well as a traditional comedy cartoon and these nostalgic revivals of kids comedy cartoons from previous eras offer some hope for the genre.

 

[The Overlord]

Come to think of it, American action cartoons have almost always relied on being based on existing IPs, with Transformers and Ninja turtles being some of the few kids action cartoons getting any merchandise at all. It's weird that right now, I can't think of any kids comedy cartoons on streaming that aren't based on existing properties like Tiny Toons or Animaniacs. Some say that dramedy cartoons like Adventure Time killed the pure comedy genre of kids cartoons, but The Cuphead Show did fairly well as a traditional comedy cartoon and these nostalgic revivals of kids comedy cartoons from previous eras offer some hope for the genre.

I would count Transformers as a new idea in 1984, Hasbro combined two toy lines from Japan and had Marvel comics create some lore for it. Same deal with He-Man in 1983, Mattel created the cartoon to promote the toy line, but was a new property in 1983. TMNT is a bit different, considering it was based on a comic book, but the adaption changed a lot of stuff. GI Joe was around forever before it got a cartoon series, so that may not count.

In terms of purely original stuff, I would say Gargoyles, Avatar, Owl House, Loud House, Spongebob, the Ghost and Molly McGee, Steven Universe, Adventure Time, Dragon Prince, Amphibia, etc all count. But there have always been adaptions, I don't think that in of itself is the problem.

 

[PicardMan]

In terms of purely original stuff, I would say Gargoyles, Avatar, Owl House, Loud House, Spongebob, the Ghost and Molly McGee, Steven Universe, Adventure Time, Dragon Prince, Amphibia, etc all count. But there have always been adaptions, I don't think that in of itself is the problem.

But all of those are linear cartoons. I'm talking about the success of non-adaptation kids (or adult) cartoons on streaming and if they can be successful.

 

[The Overlord]

But all of those are linear cartoons. I'm talking about the success of non-adaptation kids (or adult) cartoons on streaming and if they can be successful.

Well, Dragon Prince is streaming, but I take your point. I do take issue with the idea that something being adapted somehow makes it lesser than something entirely original, Arcane is a good show because it goes beyond its IP and I doubt anyone here would take issue with Batman the animated series solely because it's an adaption. The problem is when the same old things get adapted over and over again in a short period. However, I will agree we need some new ideas, but a lack of originality plagues most of Hollywood at the moment.

 

[PicardMan]

Well, Dragon Prince is streaming, but I take your point. I do take issue with the idea that something being adapted somehow makes it lesser than something entirely original, Arcane is a good show because it goes beyond its IP and I doubt anyone here would take issue with Batman the animated series solely because it's an adaption. The problem is when the same old things get adapted over and over again in a short period. However, I will agree we need some new ideas, but a lack of originality plagues most of Hollywood at the moment.

No one said there is anything wrong with the existence of animated adaptations, but the issue of non adaptations getting the Pantheon treatment is the big issue. Yes, there is the issue of some franchises that have so many iterations that it's hard to measure up to older iterations (Earthspark has the gimmick of good Megatron, but that's seemingly the only interesting thing about it).

 

[The Overlord]

No one said there is anything wrong with the existence of animated adaptations, but the issue of non adaptations getting the Pantheon treatment is the big issue. Yes, there is the issue of some franchises that have so many iterations that it's hard to measure up to older iterations (Earthspark has the gimmick of good Megatron, but that's seemingly the only interesting thing about it).

I think Pantheon had the misfortune of being on a small streaming service no one ever heard of, but I take your point. But let's face it, there have been a ton of adaptions in animation since the beginning, even the old Disney movies are adaptions of old fairy tales. I also think something that is newly adapted should get more praise than something that is being adapted over a dozen times at this point. League of Legends was never adapted until Aracne, this is the first time Invincible has been adapted. I am not looking forward to the new Spider-Man cartoon because Spidey is overexposed in animation, but a new Redwall series, considering the old series only adapted 3 of the 20 books in the series, that is something to look forward to, IMO. A lot of people were upset when Netflix scrapped its adaption of Bone, but people only care about that, because it was an adaption of a beloved property.

Like I said in another thread, most anime are just Manga adaptions. Are we counting Blood of Zeus as an adaption, because it adapts Greek mythology?

I think it's good to set a line when adaptions do and do not work.

 

[Space Cadet]

I think Pantheon had the misfortune of being on a small streaming service no one ever heard of, but I take your point. But let's face it, there have been a ton of adaptions in animation since the beginning, even the old Disney movies are adaptions of old fairy tales. I also think something that is newly adapted should get more praise than something that is being adapted over a dozen times at this point. League of Legends was never adapted until Aracne, this is the first time Invincible has been adapted. I am not looking forward to the new Spider-Man cartoon because Spidey is overexposed in animation, but a new Redwall series, considering the old series only adapted 3 of the 20 books in the series, that is something to look forward to, IMO. A lot of people were upset when Netflix scrapped its adaption of Bone, but people only care about that, because it was an adaption of a beloved property.

Like I said in another thread, most anime are just Manga adaptions. Are we counting Blood of Zeus as an adaption, because it adapts Greek mythology?

I think it's good to set a line when adaptions do and do not work.

Not that it might have changed its fate but I thought it was dumb of AMC to never run the show on their linear channel. Might have helped if it aired after one of their original series. But then again, that's a pet peeve of mine with streaming services that don't even attempt to air their original stuff on television, even as a sampler(looking at you, FX on Hulu).


Reading all the posts so far, there's definitely advantages of animation being on streaming but also downsides, namely in the promotion department. It seems television still has some advantages left in that field.

 

[The Overlord]

Not that it might have changed its fate but I thought it was dumb of AMC to never run the show on their linear channel. Might have helped if it aired after one of their original series. But then again, that's a pet peeve of mine with streaming services that don't even attempt to air their original stuff on television, even as a sampler(looking at you, FX on Hulu).


Reading all the posts so far, there's definitely advantages of animation being on streaming but also downsides, namely in the promotion department. It seems television still has some advantages left in that field.

I think that is a good way of looking at it, there are upsides and downsides to streaming and the traditional cable model.

 

[Corwin Haught]

I can't think of any kids comedy cartoons on streaming that aren't based on existing properties like Tiny Toons or Animaniacs.

Pinky Malinky ran for three seasons on Netflix. Buddy Thunderstruck had a year.

 

[AdrenalineRush1996]

Those were back during Netflix's salad days when they were actually spending money on animation.

Tuca and Bertie did not fare so well.

Well, I didn't say all of them, okay as I'm aware that Tuca and Bertie fell victim under screwed by the network before the brief revival run on Adult Swim.