The 13 “Deaths” of Cartoon Network (Editorial)

[Stumpos]

So, would one say these are the points of marking transition periods for Cartoon Network:

2001: Shows from Kids WB begin airing on the network.

October 2004: The point where Cartoon Network removed both the Boomerang block (aka the only source for the non-Scooby Doo Hanna Barbara cartoons) and the Looney Tunes shorts, with most of the pre-2004 original series (except Ed, Edd, n Eddy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, and Codename Kids Next Door) ending production at this point. Also the year they introduced the new logo and rebranded.

June 2008: Point where the pre-2007 Cartoon Network originals ended production and stopped airing premieres on a weekly basis (with Ed, Edd, n Eddy, Grim Adventures of Billy & Mandy, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, and My Gym Partner's a Monkey's final episodes either being aired as TV movies or several episodes being burned off in one day). Also when the defining shows of the 2008-10 era showed up with Flapjack, Ben 10 Alien Force, Secret Saturdays, and the Canadian cartoons such as Total Drama, 6teen, and Johnny Test. Premieres for the non-action cartoons also move from Friday to Thursday

September 2010: Point where the 2007-09 Nood era shows wrapped up aside from Johnny Test and Total Drama. Also this and 2011 introduced a TON of new shows. Premieres for the non-action shows move from Thursday to Monday. Also a rebranding and new logo.

February 2012: Cartoon Planet launches and premieres for action shows move from Friday nights to Saturday mornings. The non-action cartoons also stop premiering exclusively on one day and are split among various days now.

Summer 2014: The pre-2010 original series stopped airing regularly and premieres of all non-action shows move to Thursdays again.

2015: Teen Titans Go dominates the schedule and Adventure Time and Regular Show's airtime decreases hard.

2021: New president for the network and Cartoonito launches. Original programming from Cartoon Network slows down at this point.

 

[JMTV]

IT's quite probably MeTV Toons is going to get higher ratings than CN proper has gotten in years, so it'd be a waste anyway.

Then again, Looney Tunes has gotten very popular on MeTV in general. So of course, Toons is going to get extra boost.

 

[mqg96]

Just want to throw a few cents of mine out there, but I always thought the live-action Fridays narrative in October 2003 was over-hated.... unpopular opinion but I thought What's New Scooby-Doo and Samurai Jack being non-Cartoon Cartoons on Fridays was a good thing, it added variety to the lineup, then by late 2003 & later you had more shows on Fridays like Duck Dodgers, Pokemon, Star Wars: Clone Wars, Mucha Lucha, etc. along with Cartoon Cartoons like Powerpuff Girls or Johnny Bravo finishing its runs and a lot of new at the time original series like Foster's Home or Hi Hi Puffy Ami Yumi....

this added variety to the lineup.... having "Cartoon Cartoons" only were fine but having more series instead of just Cartoon Cartoons were for the better of the block imo, and over the years on various forums, everyone completely ignored the fact that CCF was originally live-action its first season in 1999 up until early 2000, yet no one ever complained about that. So the late 2003-early 2007 format of live-action Fridays was totally fine with me. Tommy & Tara had the best chemistry together but I feel like the Tommy & Nzinga era was underrated and had my favorite lineups imo.

There's also something left out from June 2008 from Stumpos.... and it's a big one. The Cartoon Cartoon Show (revival version) and Top 5 got cancelled... this marked the end of Cartoon Cartoon reruns being on the weekends. Which is very similar to Boomerang block for Hanna-Barbera reruns and Looney Tunes being removed in October 2004. Really just about all of the pre-2008 originals got yeeted at once around summer 2008.

I think everything else is totally spot on. Interesting reads here... about previous generations not being happy when CN started focusing on its original content instead of Hanna-Barbera reruns. I would say... when I was a child in CN's target range... I would argue the first CN death for me was around late 2004-early 2005, starting with BOOM block and Looney Tunes being removed combined with the ending of Powerpuff Girls and Johnny Bravo, and Dexter's Lab and Courage reruns being shoved to late night or early morning time slots unless Top 5 was on.

However these changes weren't too bad for me because I still had so many other series to choose from that were running and there was Miguzi and Toonami. These were very minor issues I had with the network compared to later on. So it wasn't the biggest deal but I did notice it, and disliked it at the time.

 

[Stumpos]

Anyone find it crazy how Cartoon Network 2009 had better variety than they do now?

Sure CN Real was a big failure and pretty much every pre-2007 original series ended production at this time, but at least they still reran the older stuff in that year such as Johnny Bravo, Ed Edd n Eddy, Courage the Cowardly Dog, Camp Lazlo, My Gym Partner's a Monkey, Ben 10 2005, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, and Codename Kids Next Door. Plus unlike now, there were still some original cartoons in production such as Chowder, Ben 10 Alien Force, Secret Saturdays, and Flapjack plus the upcoming shows Adventure Time, Generator Rex, Ben 10 Ultimate Alien, and Robotomy.

And even the Canadian stuff was at least decently varied.

 

[JMTV]

Anyone find it crazy how Cartoon Network 2009 had better variety than they do now?

Sure CN Real was a big failure and pretty much every pre-2007 original series ended production at this time, but at least they still reran the older stuff in that year such as Johnny Bravo, Ed Edd n Eddy, Courage the Cowardly Dog, Camp Lazlo, My Gym Partner's a Monkey, Ben 10 2005, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy, and Codename Kids Next Door. Plus unlike now, there were still some original cartoons in production such as Chowder, Ben 10 Alien Force, Secret Saturdays, and Flapjack plus the upcoming shows Adventure Time, Generator Rex, Ben 10 Ultimate Alien, and Robotomy.

And even the Canadian stuff was at least decently varied.

Does it really matter? That still doesn't change the fact that CN didn't premiere any new original series in 2009.

 

[Stumpos]

Does it really matter? That still doesn't change the fact that CN didn't premiere any new original series in 2009.

If you wanna get technical, the live action shows were their original shows in 2009. Plus, we still had the knowledge that they were still PRODUCING new original cartoons between the current slate and the upcoming ones (unlike now where pretty much every upcoming original cartoon is gonna be on Adult Swim).

Heck, Adventure Time was intended to be premiere in Fall 2009 back when it was greenlit in August 2008, so it is possible Adventure Time was supposed to be Cartoon Network's 2009 original cartoon had there not been some delays.

And simply premiering new original cartoons isn't an automatic indicator of quality of the channel's schedule. After all, Cartoon Network had a lot of original shows from 2015 to 2021, but they were poorly treated and barely got aired due to the channel emphasizing Teen Titans Go a lot in that time.

I'll stress that 2009 wasn't the best year for the channel, but it was still leagues better compared to how the channel's been since 2015.

 

[JMTV]

If you wanna get technical, the live action shows were their original shows in 2009. Plus, we still had the knowledge that they were still PRODUCING new original cartoons between the current slate and the upcoming ones (unlike now where pretty much every upcoming original cartoon is gonna be on Adult Swim).

Heck, Adventure Time was intended to be premiere in Fall 2009 back when it was greenlit in August 2008, so it is possible Adventure Time was supposed to be Cartoon Network's 2009 original cartoon had there not been some delays.

And simply premiering new original cartoons isn't an automatic indicator of quality of the channel's schedule. After all, Cartoon Network had a lot of original shows from 2015 to 2021, but they were poorly treated and barely got aired due to the channel emphasizing Teen Titans Go a lot in that time.

I'll stress that 2009 wasn't the best year for the channel, but it was still leagues better compared to how the channel's been since 2015.

Okay, fine, but my point still stands.

 

[mqg96]

If you wanna get technical, the live action shows were their original shows in 2009. Plus, we still had the knowledge that they were still PRODUCING new original cartoons between the current slate and the upcoming ones (unlike now where pretty much every upcoming original cartoon is gonna be on Adult Swim).

Heck, Adventure Time was intended to be premiere in Fall 2009 back when it was greenlit in August 2008, so it is possible Adventure Time was supposed to be Cartoon Network's 2009 original cartoon had there not been some delays.

And simply premiering new original cartoons isn't an automatic indicator of quality of the channel's schedule. After all, Cartoon Network had a lot of original shows from 2015 to 2021, but they were poorly treated and barely got aired due to the channel emphasizing Teen Titans Go a lot in that time.

I'll stress that 2009 wasn't the best year for the channel, but it was still leagues better compared to how the channel's been since 2015.

Cable was also still very strong in 2009 and streaming apps weren't really a thing back in that time. Digital cable packages and "On Demand" were like at its peak in 2009. Considering that cable was still very much in its prime, 2009 was one of CN's worst years.

2009 was the only year when there were no originals that premiered, CN Real was a thing, and there was no Toonami to be found anywhere at the same time.

I know you had Powerpuff Girls Rule, and the ending of Foster's Home and Ed Edd n Eddy, but those were just special events, those weren't on the regular or daily 2009 schedule.

Is the 2016-present Cartoon Network scheduling and branding much weaker than 2009 CN? Arguably yes.. but from 2016-present the rise in streaming apps got stronger and stronger so there were other ways to watch these series... whereas back in 2009 it was mostly thru cable or On Demand (buying DVD's if the series was available would've been the only other option).

 

[Goldstar!]

Presently, this is the lowest point that Cartoon Network has been in years, and now I'm hearing that Warner Bros Discovery could be either merging with another studio or tech company like Sony or perhaps even selling off some of its properties.

I don't want to sound like a Debbie Downer, but I really don't see CN the channel coming back from this. However, as it was said in the Illumination movie Sing!, the one good thing about being at the bottom is that there's nowhere to go but up.

 

[Stumpos]

I genuinely am wondering, how can Cartoon Network possible turn itself around at this point?

I know things are a mess ever since the Discovery merger with Warner Bros, but it's not like Cartoon Network was any better before that either with how things were going since 2015.

Makes me wonder if there is a way to get Cartoon Network to return to the glory days of either 1999-2003 or even the Silver eras of 2004-07 and 2010-14?

 

[PicardMan]

Makes me wonder if there is a way to get Cartoon Network to return to the glory days of either 1999-2003 or even the Silver eras of 2004-07 and 2010-14?

Maybe not dump all their action originals on Adult Swim for being "too violent." Maybe make some comedy cartoons. They do have a Canukitoon premiere in the Total Drama Island reboot, but that doesn't feel like a new show when that franchise has been run on Cartoon Network since the 00s. They did air a Eurotoon in Ivandoe that aired in Europe in 2017, but it seems like Americans don't care about it. I think Totally Spies is also coming back. Like Total Drama Isand, this is another franchise that goes way back. They have a history of relying on Eurotoons and Canukitoons, so maybe the plan is to rely on them

 

[JMTV]

I genuinely am wondering, how can Cartoon Network possible turn itself around at this point?

Honestly, the only way for Cartoon Network can truly turn itself around is by premiering dozens of new shows all at once.

Other than that, there’s nothing else can be done. I don’t want to be a pessimist because I do want CN to pick itself back up but let’s be real, the damage has been done. Unless the people at the top of WBD does have a change of heart and believe that CN is still a valuable brand to be salvageable, I don’t think they will turn things around.

 

[Leviathan]

The damage has been done to all of cable. People have flocked to streaming for everything except live sports and live news.

At best, Warner Bros. will get sold off to another company that will see fit to invest in more original programming.

 

[PicardMan]

The damage has been done to all of cable. People have flocked to streaming for everything except live sports and live news.

Maybe the question should be more, can Max be saved as a cartoon destination? They burned bridges badly with cartoon fans with the great cartoon purge of 2022 and seem to have preference towards adult comedy cartoons like Harley Quinn and Rick and Morty versus anything else. Infinity Train, and Scavengers Reign got the boot, Young Justice got cancelled before it could finish its story, Jellystone seems like the crown jewel for Max when it comes to family friendly animation as adult fans come for the Hannah Barbara characters who debuted 50-60 years ago and kids can enjoy the show too. Fionna and Cake is a great piece of adult animation that is technically an adult comedy cartoon although it doesn't use the vulgar humor stereotypical of the genre (also an update to one of Cartoon Network's most beloved shows). If Max is to replace Cartoon Network/Adult Swim, are Jellystone, Fionna and Cake, Harley Quinn, and the Kite Man spinoff of Harley Quinn signs that maybe Max can fill Cartoon Network/Adult Swim's role as the place for cartoons? Still, Jellystone is the only family cartoon I mentioned, so I think that Max is more set to be Adult Swim's successor than Cartoon Network's.

 

[JMTV]

Maybe the question should be more, can Max be saved as a cartoon destination?

That’s hard to say because it’s going to take a lot of work for Max to gain trust in the people that they lost, both the talent and the community.

They burned bridges badly with cartoon fans with the great cartoon purge of 2022 and seem to have preference towards adult comedy cartoons like Harley Quinn and Rick and Morty versus anything else.

Then again, WBD burned bridges with actual talent working on these cartoons. Let’s not forget, Owen Dennis said that WBD’s bad business practices soured the relationship with a lot of creators and talent behind the scenes. Hell, even Cartoon Network straight up disagreed what WBD was doing.

Sometimes, I have to wonder if the executives and shareholders just love the bad publicity they get or they just don’t care?

Infinity Train, and Scavengers Reign got the boot,

At least Scavengers Reign was lucky enough to be part of Netflix. Infinity Train never got tripe.

Young Justice got cancelled before it could finish its story

As far as I’m aware, at least Young Justice gets to stay on the platform.

Jellystone seems like the crown jewel for Max when it comes to family friendly animation as adult fans come for the Hannah Barbara characters who debuted 50-60 years ago and kids can enjoy the show too.

Despite the half ass, bare minimum advertising for Season 3 several months ago.

Fionna and Cake is a great piece of adult animation that is technically an adult comedy cartoon although it doesn't use the vulgar humor stereotypical of the genre (also an update to one of Cartoon Network's most beloved shows).

True. At least with Fionna and Cake shows that young adult animation still has a place in the industry, and you don’t need to make your show look like stereotypical adult cartoon #375 in order to become a success. Just make a good show is all we ask for.

If Max is to replace Cartoon Network/Adult Swim, are Jellystone, Fionna and Cake, Harley Quinn, and the Kite Man spinoff of Harley Quinn signs that maybe Max can fill Cartoon Network/Adult Swim's role as the place for cartoons?

I don’t know. Max is still relatively new and it’s still trying to find its footing. I wouldn’t say Max can fill for CN/AS because if they were, they wouldn’t get freaking rid of a lot of CN legacy content just for the sake of saving money on residuals.

Still, Jellystone is the only family cartoon I mentioned, so I think that Max is more set to be Adult Swim's successor than Cartoon Network's.

Well, Adult Swim has been gaining more ad revenue than Cartoon Network, so I wouldn’t say Max is filling the void for CN/AS just yet.

 

[Silverstar]

At best, Warner Bros. will get sold off to another company that will see fit to invest in more original programming.

I'd hate to see Warner Bros. get sold off and have to go through the restructuring process yet again, especially if it were to get handed over to the Mouse or Nick Paramount, but it would be worth it if it meant them having a parent company that actually gives a crap about WB, its' IPs and their creators.

Honestly, the only way for Cartoon Network can truly turn itself around is by premiering dozens of new shows all at once.

Other than that, there’s nothing else can be done. I don’t want to be a pessimist because I do want CN to pick itself back up but let’s be real, the damage has been done. Unless the people at the top of WBD does have a change of heart and believe that CN is still a valuable brand to be salvageable, I don’t think they will turn things around.

^This.^

It's possible that WBD has a bunch of stuff waiting in the wings for CN and they're just waiting for more money to generate in order to unveil them, but that's being super-duper optimistic. With cable itself slowly going extinct, streaming services playing musical chairs and Zas and company screwing over so many creative talent, I just don't see Cartoon Network coming out of this current plummet, at least not as a linear TV channel. I'm just not getting a savior/"we care" vibe from Discovery.

 

[aegisrawks]

Again, that's like putting a Band-Aid on the Titanic. Cartoon Network needs to have more than just that if they want to impress me. Where are the 1990s Cartoon-Cartoons? No, they're not new, but that would add some variety to the channel. Plus, they're all IPs that Warner Bros. owns outright, so airing them wouldn't cost them a dime. Heck, even if CN became Boomerang for a few hours of the day and just ran Looney Tunes, Tom & Jerry, the MGM shorts, Popeye and the Hanna-Barbera cartoons from the 1960s to 1990s all afternoon, that would at least be something different.

And stop giving everything that's good and/or original to Adult Swim. And move AS back to late nights, where it belongs.

While you are a grown up who CN should have no business catering to, you are indeed correct that this IS a Band Aid on the Titanic and CN needs more to impress ANYONE, let alone kids or even adults. CN is the channel that manages to have NOTHING to offer. Seinfeld should air on CN because it is the channel about NOTHING.

 

[Stumpos]

I wonder now though, is there any kids cable channel that's actually doing good right now? This thread's already brought up Cartoon Network, but look at the others.

Looking at the others:

• Nickelodeon: Pretty much reliant on SpongeBob since the late 2000s with Loud House being the only other show they care about and Nick Jr block as their only regular content outside those two with other cartoons getting little to no airtime. They haven't even been airing live action sitcoms anymore either aside from The Really Loud House.
• Disney Channel: Probably the best of these right now and having actual stuff in production for the channel. Not perfect given how they treated Owl House, Molly McGee, and Hailey's On It, but still higher than the other kids cable networks.
• The Hub/Discovery Family: Stopped doing original shows after Pony Life and Rescue Bots Academy ended in 2021. And it's clear Zaslav doesn't care enough to add new original shows and pretty much has it as a discount Boomerang with only the Hasbro cartoons distinguishing it from Boomerang (even then, their contract with Hasbro ends on March 31st of next year so they'll pretty much lose that and truly become "Boomerang but with live action Discovery on primetime and late night hours").
• Universal Kids: No one even remembers that it exists and pretty much no one knows or cares about the shows they're currently airing reruns of.

And that doesn't even cover the other channels that are subsidiaries of the main cable channels such as Nicktoons, Disney XD, Disney Junior, Nick Junior, Boomerang, Freeform, and Teen Nick.

Makes one wonder if kids cable is even gonna to have any value in a decade from now. Can kids cable ever be saved at all by now with the shape it's in right now?

 

[aegisrawks]

Guys I have disasterrific news! Craig Of The Creek had over 100k viewers, making it the only cartoon on CN worth a damn... but they cancelled so CN's doomed after this lol.

 

[Goldstar!]

To @PicardMan's point: If WB's plan is for Max to become the studio's go-to hub for Cartoon Network and Adult Swim shows, you'd never guess that given how rarely the animated shows on Max are ever advertised. How many spots were made for Jellystone season 3 or Scavenger's Reign? Hint: start with 1 and then work your way down.

To be fair, Disney doesn't advertise its cartoon library on Disney+ very often either, it's mostly the Star Wars and Marvel shows, but we're talking about Disney here. The Disney name is practically synonymous with animation, so the presence of the Disney cartoon library was always kind of implied. Disney did advertise the premiere of "Steamboat Silly", which was significant due to it being the last Mickey Mouse short directed by Paul Rudish.

The Hub/Discovery Family: Stopped doing original shows after Pony Life and Rescue Bots Academy ended in 2021. And it's clear Zaslav doesn't care enough to add new original shows and pretty much has it as a discount Boomerang with only the Hasbro cartoons distinguishing it from Boomerang (even then, their contract with Hasbro ends on March 31st of next year so they'll pretty much lose that and truly become "Boomerang but with live action Discovery on primetime and late night hours").

In WB's defense, Discovery Family is in even fewer homes than Boomerang is, so there's no incentive on WB's part to air anything significant on that channel. Why should WB try to cater to an audience that isn't there?