The portrayal of black people in anime

[zano88]

good thread, everyone has interesting points
as a black person whose been following anime since the voltron days, heres my take on it......when i was a kid and i noticed the lack of , and sometimes negative or uninteresting, portrayal of people who looked like me, i just decided to start making up my own characters and thats what ive been doing every since....i just stopped expecting them to tell my story in any way that wasnt relevant to their story..

 

[Kaiser0120]

>.>

*Raises his hand lightly, about to protest about the mistreatment of homosexuals in anime by stereotyping them.*

*He then realizes that every homosexual is represented as a pretty boy or a drag queen or a flaming homo (Fred)... Then he thinks about the fact that none of the stereotypes are really that sterotypical, they're just emphasizing on certain points.

*After more internal arguing, he takes into the fact that while there are stereotypes, they're always protrayed as good people, never dislikable for the sake of being dislikable.

*He then shrugs and sighs, because when you get right down to it... it's just not worth getting all pissy over it.*

 

[Dalamar13]

After seeing all the PCness of this thread I must go purge my stomach.


Like Larry Mojo said, stereotypes are everywhere, they're in everything. You're just going to have to get over it. I don't get pissed when they protray people of Irish decent as drunks( I refuse to use the ,insert nationality here-american thing, if you were born here you're American and thats it). It's one thing if they're being flat out racist about it, but if it's obvious they're just being your typical person abou it then who cares.

 

[Mackenzie Rainelle]

I've gotten used to Southerners being portrayed as backwards-ass redneck crackers. There's never been another way we've been shown, except in Gone With the Wind, and THAT'S not exactly flattering either.

As for Nadia from Secret of the Blue Water, she was never sure if she was African or Indian, since she had looks from both races.

Akio Ohtori and Anthy Himemiya from Shoujo Kakumei Utena are both designed to be Indian (as in India, not American). I though the bindi on Anthy's forehead would have been a dead giveaway about that, but I guess not.

 

[Mike Toole]

Yeah, a lot of minorities just don't get a fair shake in anime. As has been stated, it's mostly just because the Japanese creators aren't really aware of some ethnicities, or just don't really take them into consideration. How many Jewish anime characters are there? Some think Spike Spiegel is, and I could buy that-- and there's also Big Ear from The Big O, with his orthodox dressing habits. But not much elsse comes to mind.

I will say that Turn A Gundam is interesting, because there's this character, Loran Cehack, and he's black. He's not a supporting character, or the lead character's friend or something. He's the main character!

Of course, I suppose his ethnicity is debatable, what with his green eyes and silvery hair. Still, his skin tone is very dark, and that ain't a tan. (As for where he comes from, it's not Atlantis or Africa-- it's the moon. ) I always just figured he was black. He's a cool character too, lots of charisma and passion. I'm looking forward to seeing Turn A Gundam in English, which hopefully won't take more than another couple of years to happen.

 

[Feslmogh]

Originally posted by Mynd Hed

The only real example I can think of off the top of my head of an accurately portrayed recurring black character in anime is the host of Big Shots in Cowboy Bebop. He's a fairly minor character, but not only is he animated realistically instead of the "jet black skin big pink lips" thing, he's also a very sympathetic character from the little you see of him outside of hosting Big Shots. In his character as Big Shots host, he functions as comic relief, but he does it in a way that I feel should be non-offensive to black people. "Shucks howdy!"

*Enters Bliken mode from "Robrn Hood-Men In Tights"*
He's Black?

*normal Mode*
I thought he was hispanic...

 

[Zechs]

It is kinda anyoing to see blacks portrayed the way we are totay not onli in amime but in american shows as well. Only now are they starting to show blacks in shows and most are comedies. As for anime rember these people are in Japan so they hive on true knodgle a how blacks really act. Besides how many times has american ptrayed asians as tightwads, nerds or martial arts masters. Sterotypes are everywhere and we'll never get away from them. I myself got sick and tired of not seeing many blacks in animation not to mention american T.V also I got sick of seeing women being portyed as weak and needing to be saved. I alreday loved to write and draw so I started to make my own stories most were ment to be comics. I hope to be able to have them puplished one day.

 

[Mynd Hed]

I thought he was hispanic...

When he's "in character" hosting Big Shots, he uses a very cheesy faux Hispanic accent as part of the "flavor" of the show. But when you see him in the airport talking to his mother, he speaks in a very normal, soft-spoken voice. In any case, being Hispanic is an ethnic and language-based thing, and being black is a racial-based thing. So there's no reason that someone couldn't be both black AND Hispanic. However, the host of Big Shots is definitely NOT Hispanic, or at least, he doesn't normally speak with the same cheesy accent he uses in the show.

 

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Mackenzie Rainelle
I've gotten used to Southerners being portrayed as backwards-ass redneck crackers. There's never been another way we've been shown, except in Gone With the Wind, and THAT'S not exactly flattering either.

As for Nadia from Secret of the Blue Water, she was never sure if she was African or Indian, since she had looks from both races.

Akio Ohtori and Anthy Himemiya from Shoujo Kakumei Utena are both designed to be Indian (as in India, not American). I though the bindi on Anthy's forehead would have been a dead giveaway about that, but I guess not.

That's not from the interviews I've heard. The creators said that they were black. Yes, the bindi is an obvious design giveawa, but on further inspection it is more of a design aesthetic than an indication of ethnicity.

But then, this is Utena. Ethnicity doesn't really matter. Everyone is designed a specific way for aesthetic design reasons, not realism.

 

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by spyke
Winston from the real ghostbusters,dianah from the D&D cartoon,Doc from te galaxy rangers,war machine from the 2nd season of iron man,black panther from the 2nd season of the FF,stalker from GI JOE (although they did'nt show him much),GL john stewert from the justice league cartoon (he's more interesting in te JL cartoon then he's ever been in the comics),goran from the phantom 2040 cartoon,cyborg from the super powers cartoon,IQ from the bionic six (though at times he is a little borring),storm from x-men evolution,spyke (when he has an attitude) from x-men evolution,J from MIB,and elisa and derick mazda from gargoyles are great black characters in american animation.

I see te PJ's in the same light that you see khan fro king ofthe hill. It's stereotypical most of the time, but it's funny as hell.

Dinah--Boring, good-goody.
War Machine--Boring, no personality.
Eliza from Gargoyles--Not really black.
Super Powers cartoon characters--all characters thin as heck.
Black Panther in FF--Not as interesting as his new comic.

I see about 3 interesting black characters in your list. Winston being the top choice. All the others are super serious humourless characters with no charisma and are P.C. as heck.

 

[RZetlin]

Originally posted by spyke
I see te PJ's in the same light that you see khan fro king ofthe hill. It's stereotypical most of the time, but it's funny as hell.

Then where would a person draw a line between comedy or just insulting a certain minority?

I remember when the PJ's came out. The Black community was up in arms over the show. Director Spike Lee condemn the show as offensive.

There is a paradox that exist when dealing with minorities in the entertainment business.

If you start having minorities in the shows there is a chance that you might insult some of them. If you leave them out you would be accused of sidelining minorities.

Ever watched Disney's John Henry?

I am not surprise if you didn't because Disney has kept this movie in the dark.

Why? Because the majority of staff that worked on the movie is White. As the crazy logic goes how can White people understand Black culture?

Studios are always playing a game of Russian Roulette with the protrayal of minorities. There is always the chance the studio will get hit over an issue.

 

[Dub]

Actually Elisa is half black and half native american according to Greg Weisman (Gargoyles creator). Derrick had a more of his mothers look (black female) while Elisa had more of her fathers (native american). But either way, I had always seen Elisa as a very positive black female role model that is a MAIN CHARACTER in a cartoon - something that to this day is still almost non-existant.

 

[RZetlin]

There's something to be said, "if you don't like how minorities are being protrayed you can always try and create your own."

Just like Aaron McGruder's anime influenced Boondocks.

 

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by Jon "WB" Gray
Actually Elisa is half black and half native american according to Greg Weisman (Gargoyles creator). Derrick had a more of his mothers look (black female) while Elisa had more of her fathers (native american). But either way, I had always seen Elisa as a very positive black female role model that is a MAIN CHARACTER in a cartoon - something that to this day is still almost non-existant.

One could say the TV suits wanted her to look less traditionally black for marketing reasons. She looks almost Asian, has caucasian styled hair, and has "light" dark skin. If you didn't tell someone she was half black, they wouldn't know it.

 

[spyke]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
Dinah--Boring, good-goody.
War Machine--Boring, no personality.
Eliza from Gargoyles--Not really black.
Super Powers cartoon characters--all characters thin as heck.
Black Panther in FF--Not as interesting as his new comic.

I see about 3 interesting black characters in your list. Winston being the top choice. All the others are super serious humourless characters with no charisma and are P.C. as heck.

Dianah from D&D was not "boring" or a "goody-goody". She had a sense of humor and a sassy attitude (just look at all the times she insulted eric or talk back to bad guys). Now hank, hewas a goody-goody (but not boring).

If you watch the entire 2nd season of iron man, you will see that war machine was anything but boring, and he also had a great personality. For example, he was'nt afraid to tell tony/iron man when he was wrong, he had a great sense of humor,and he was afraid of being trapped in his armor because of the psychoogical trauma he suffered as a child after watching his best friend drown before his eyes and he himself later being traped in his armor under water.

The black panther in the FF cartoon was very similar to how he was portrayed in the comics at that time. His willingness to kidnap the FF to achieve his own personal goals (even if it was for the greater good), is an important flaw of his character.

 

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

Originally posted by spyke
Dianah from D&D was not "boring" or a "goody-goody". She had a sense of humor and a sassy attitude (just look at all the times she insulted eric or talk back to bad guys). Now hank, hewas a goody-goody (but not boring).

If you watch the entire 2nd season of iron man, you will see that war machine was anything but boring, and he also had a great personality. For example, he was'nt afraid to tell tony/iron man when he was wrong, he had a great sense of humor,and he was afraid of being trapped in his armor because of the psychoogical trauma he suffered as a child after watching his best friend drown before his eyes and he himself later being traped in his armor under water.

The black panther in the FF cartoon was very similar to how he was portrayed in the comics at that time. His willingness to kidnap the FF to achieve his own personal goals (even if it was for the greater good), is an important flaw of his character.

Fair enough. But I listed about 9 or 10 positive anime portrayals in a previous post, and I'm recalling several more at this moment. So in the end, the point is that there is good and bad in everything. You have only dwelt on the bad. I don't totally disagree with you, but I don't think a total sweeping statement can be made about blacks in anime either.

 

[spyke]

Originally posted by Leaping Larry Jojo
Fair enough. But I listed about 9 or 10 positive anime portrayals in a previous post, and I'm recalling several more at this moment. So in the end, the point is that there is good and bad in everything. You have only dwelt on the bad. I don't totally disagree with you, but I don't think a total sweeping statement can be made about blacks in anime either.

Actualy, if you go and re-read my first post as well as my 2nd post on this thread, you will see that I named some positive portrayals of blacks in anime.

Oh yeah, one more thing. Could you (or anyone for that matter) please tell me if Blade from the Sin anime is supposed to be half black and half white?

 

[Leaping Larry Jojo]

You did. But you gave the impression that there were maybe four or five good characters in the whole of animedom only, and I have a feeling there may be more than that, and at worst, it isn't much poorer than the number of good ones in American animation.

As for Sin, I forgot. The anime as a whole sucked, anyway.

 

[zimbach]

I guess it comes down to this:

Don't ascribe malice to what can be more readily explained by ignorance or stupidity.

Of course, one should educate the ignorant and correct the stupid, but also recognize when no harm was intended.

 

[RockItShipper]

Droids had at least one interracial relationship between a "black" woman and "white" man... But like anything set in a science fiction or fantasy universe, human race and sexuality issues as we know them can't possibly exist in an entirely created world. In fact, said issues are usually explored through different kinds of humanoids or sentinent beings- possibly unintentionally in some cases.

Anime-wise.... Hollywood opinion overall is that projects with black leads will not do well in foreign markets, especially Japan. That's part of why there's the genre of interracial buddy film like "I Spy" and the "Rush Hour" movies. It's a way of making a sure bet overseas and make a picture with cross-demographic appeal in the US. The likes of Barbershop and Undercover Brother don't get extensive overseas distribution. Also, foreign markets do have access to stereotypical studio output unavailable in the US- such as Song of the South. For all I know, Stepin Fetchit(sp?) scenes may not be trimmed outside the US.

As for yaoi/yuri stuff, most of it falls under fan service and has more to do with getting into another market. A Digimon toy sold is a Digimon toy sold, whether the consumer is a kid who thinks the toy is cool or a yaoi/yuri fangirl who knows what's really up with DNA evolution. But this may end up being more famous in future years. Traditional belief is that the "true" lesbian is the sporty, clumsy girl- and the one who likes to sew and sing and is rarely in pants or shorts is either her 'victim' or inrefutably straight. Of course, anyone who's seen CCSakura knows that's not the case. Tomoyo is a sweet girly girl who likes girls and appears to have a girlfriend by the show's end.